The Human Polygraph w/ Susan Ibitz

🌟 The Human Polygraph 

🤔 Dyslexia and Autism can be Major Challenges in Life. But, when Coupled with Unbridled Curiosity and Courage they can be Become a Superpower. Therefore, check out this episode and discover how my Guest, the Human Polygraph, Susan Ibitz, shows you the how to become a Superhero by Unlocking the Keys to Reading Human Behavior. 

🌟 What We Discuss with Susan:

👉 ⁃       Curiosity, Dyslexia, and Autism as her Superpowers

👉 ⁃       Becoming the Human Polygraph

👉 ⁃       Three Keys to Reading Behavior

👉 ⁃       How to be Present for Others

 
 🌟 About Susan:

Susan Ibitz; is a Human Behavior Hacker- Some people hack computers, she hacks Humans. And has so much fun doing it. Susan is a profiler – Civilian Hostage Negotiator Trainer– Face Reader Profiler - Trial Consultant. She traveled around the world chasing the best of the best. studied with Paul Ekman International in the UK Micro-Expression and Deception Detection, Persuasion with Cialdini, and Statement Analysis with Sapir [ he is the man who developed what others are teaching, he is the father of the way you can find deception detection].

Susan holds over 30 certifications, including Harvard Law school, Civilian Hostage Negotiator level 3, and Face Reading Profiling and is still going.

 
🙏  Thanks, Susan! Reach out, connect, and follow Susan across all her social platforms:

👉 -       https://www.linkedin.com/in/susan-ibitz/

👉 -       facebook.com/SusanIbitzHBL/

🌟 Resources mentioned in the podcast:

👉 -       https://susanibitz.com/

Pre-Order my Latest Book: "Unbreakable Alliances: A Spy Recruiters Authoritative Guide to Cultivating Powerful & Lasting Connections" HERE

Unlocking the Power of Trust: Keynote Speaker Robin Dreeke Shares Secrets to Creating Allies - Robin is the former Chief of the FBI's Counterintelligence Behavioral Analysis Program. With over 30 years of experience in recruiting spies and building trust, Robin is the world-renowned speaker you need. Don't miss out on the opportunity to learn from a true expert. Contact us now to book your event! Click HERE to book a time to chat.

🤔 Take Robin's FREE YouTube Keys to Communication Online Course HERE.

😃 Check out Robin's Speaking, and Training Services HERE.

Transcript

Robin: 0:04

Well-behaved women never make history. Welcome to the Forged By Trust podcast. I'm your host, Robin Dreeke, executive coach, former US Marines, spy recruiter, bestselling author, and your trust and communication expert. Today's episode, the Human Polygraph, is with the Force of Nature, Susan Ibitz and what she can do for you at the Human Behavior Lab. Susan works to help people to be their best version of themselves. She teaches you how to profile anyone in 90 seconds over the phone, a picture, video call, or in person. Either in her online classes where you can jump in anytime at your own pace or in a group training, or you can hire her to do one-on-one coaching. She will teach you a superpower to have the life you always wanted, the income that you dreamed about, and she can take you wherever you want to go. Coming up next on the Forged By Trust podcast.

Susan: 0:52

I was a rebel. Years later, I understand that I was overcompensating for my dyslexia and my autism. There are three ways you can be good in this job. Who you are. How you feeling. And how predisposed you are not to drink your own Kool-Aid and walk in a room thinking everybody have a reason. Everybody's telling you the truth. I just wanna know if you're lying and go with the flaw.

Robin: 1:44

Today's episode, the Human Polygraph, is with Susan Ibitz. Susan Ibitz is a human behavior hacker. Some people hack computers. She hacks humans and has so much fun doing it. Susan is a profiler civilian hostage crisis negotiator trainer, face reading profiler, trial consultant, and she's traveled around the world chasing the best of the best. Studied with Paul Eckman International in the uk. Micro-expression and deception detection. Persuasion with chaldini and statement analysis with peer. And he is the man who developed what others are teaching. Susan holds over 30 certifications, including Harvard Law School, civilian hostage, negotiator, level three, and face reading profile, and is still going during an episode. Today we talk about curiosity, dyslexia, and autism as a gift, becoming the human polygraph. Three keys to reading behavior and how to be. For others. Susan, all I can do is say hello. Welcome to Forged by Trust. And as we are just chatting before and the numerous chats we've had, Yes, you are known as a human, polygraph human behavior expert. But I gotta tell you what, I think your real superpower is making me laugh. So anyway, thank you. And thank you for joining me today.

Susan: 3:02

I hope people have as much fun as we have on the prep and during this show, and I expect that because laugh and smiling, elevate oxytocin and we are elevate dopamine. Those are the bonding or so let's says we are gonna be geeky fun if it's

Robin: 3:19

possible. Geeky fun, hormone inducing fun. Yes, absolutely. So kind of going back to what I just said, as you know, and as my audience knows, there's nothing better in life than a great story and a great backstory, and especially since we all love human behavior, especially since you are an expert in polygraph as you're the human polygraph. I'm curious what was a spark all those years ago that inspired you to, to really follow and make human behavior your passion?

Susan: 3:53

I didn't have Columbia and it was the fir, the best thing that happened to me was failure. And I don't remember who says the phrase, but mistaken failure if you don't learn anything from it. And at the young age, and I always say the same story, my dad believe in quality time now. Quantity time with the four kids. He was a diplomat doing something completely different. He never, he finished barely high school because

Robin: 4:16

he lost his. And where was this? I'm so sorry.

Susan: 4:19

Where was this? My dad was in Argentina. First generation took Calab, Italian Calab, no simp, Italian Calabrese in Argentina, and he was an artist. And he was called to go around the world recovering a stolen art from the Nazis because my dad met my mom, who is the first generation of Auschwitz survivors? My grandmother. Hold on. What

Robin: 4:44

I gotta, there is so much here. I already got, I can pull a lot. What kind of artist was he?

Susan: 4:51

He studied with Pet Picazo. Actually, some of the arts in my house, people says, oh, this is a Picazo. No, that is my dad, and actually have a painting. Then you know what? My dad was a storyteller and he was a dreamer. He was an a doer. I always says, I love my doctor dad that he was always on the birds to be broke because he he dream all the time. And where did your dad grow? My dad grew up in a small town called visa Maria Cordova in the north part of Argentina that when he grow up, he lost his dad when he was three months old. My grandmother was 21 with two kids, Italian family. She were black until she was 40. Wow. Crazy. Yep. And what, what

Robin: 5:40

sparked his passion for art when he was so,

Susan: 5:41

It was his way to communicate. Remember this was on the twenties or thirties. I, yeah. My dad should be 95 now. He died 45 years ago. Yeah, so it was a long time ago. So his grandfather, I think all my family linears, both sides are really remarkable by the grandparents. In my case, my grandmothers and my dad, grandfather. He used to, like, old school is like do I don't know how you name it in any other language than Spanish S. There are los, the little wheels that you have with metal. So his grandfather used to do es like big skateboards with wheels so he can be pulled by the bike from another person. Okay. So my dad spent a lot of time with that and my grandmother was an artist. My, my dad's. But being an artist, it was being a prostitute. You cannot be a woman and an artist if you're a widow. So my grandmother and start painting, hiding from her parents and from society, and that was the quality time between my dad and my grandmother. Hmm. When she was hiding at night painting. And she was a couture designer. And my sense of styles always says, oh, you have a good sense of style. I know I have two grandmothers. They have a really good sense of style, so she was a couture designer during the day. And she was a painter at night and my dad and my grandmother had Carolina have that moment when she was painting and the smell of the paint was a connection to him. So he start painting on the floor and my grandmother start putting pieces of canvas for him to paint. He have the chance to go to Europe, and that's where he started, and I think it was in. He studied with Picasso. One of the paintings that I have in one of my walls, my dad always says it was, it's an original Picasso, and my investment advisor says, we need to make it like assess. He says, you know what? I don't care if it's a Picasso. It's the fantasy that I spend. Hours and days with my dad in his studio telling me the story about the painting. If it's not, you're gonna take part of my childhood, it's not about the money. We're not gonna sell it. Right? Right. I'm gonna leave it to my niece and nephews, they can assess. It's part of my story, it's part of my storytelling, it's part of my quality time with my dad since say, what's five years? So, and says, what do you want me to be yours when you move out and says that painting? So we built a story through that painting. Maybe have a big cast on, I can't retire. No idea. Gonna keep it on the wall.

Robin: 8:18

Wow. So how did you get into going around the world and finding art that had been stolen from the Jews.

Susan: 8:26

And it's crazy because my dad was in a diplomat and actually going through things. When my brother, when we lost my mom two years ago, we found out the business card of my dad with a seal. Actually, he was a console. It's console. The diplomat was a council, is an art from Guatemala to round the. So not even in Buenos Aires. So it was one of his connection. My dad have a really good sense of art, like more artists are clueless and useless on marketing and selling themselves that he loved art and he was really good. Actually. He died at the age of 90. Managing a foundation for new artists to make sure they are support and they can expose. He was a natural. He's was a really good artist. He was so prolific that when he die, we need to hire four trucks to get his art in a warehouse to beed to see how the heck we gonna, because we living all around the world. All my brothers and sisters and nephew, nobody's on Argentina. We are all over the world. How we gonna make sure that we can get that art and bring it with us? So we decide to put in a warehouse. We need to get four. To transport all the art. My dad was doing two paintings a week, and I remember he's sitting in front of the white canvas and the joke is, I haven't talked to you yet. Like, sh the canvas is talking to me, deciding what she wanna be. Oh, he wanna be like, okay, let's go for it. So I'm not insane. It's generic labor position. My parents were right. I'm already laughing. Okay. I'm Jewish. I'm not gonna be ever good in this sport where good in in therapy, I need to blame my parents. Come on. That's what we're supposed to do. Who you gonna be blaming your parents? That's what you do, right?

Robin: 10:23

Okay. So we come up through childhood with an amazing backstory and storyteller of a father who's an artist. What were you aspiring to do at that age?

Susan: 10:34

I wanted to be the first female astronaut until I found out it was one is this. Nope, I'm not interested anymore. I was, you know what? What inspired you wanna be an astronaut? Oh, because nobody else has done it. At that point, I was a rebel. My dad sent me to Valette and I didn't want it. My mom decide to shape my head for the first time when I was six years old, five years old, and I was in kindergarten because I was fighting with the. And I always have pieces of hair missing and I never was the proper lady. I was kicked out of a school until they finally put me in a Catholic car, kindergarten, because my parents were paying so much money, they didn't kick me out. So

Robin: 11:18

what were you fighting about?

Susan: 11:20

I was a rebel. I didn't feel that I belong. I like to play with, I didn't wanna be playing with dolls. They gave me dolls. Why, why they can go out and make money. I need to wait at home. At what age were you saying that? Four or five years. Sorry. When you go to kindergarten says, we're gonna play mom and dad. Like, I don't wanna be mom. My na my mom was really worried until I was 15. I have my, my best book, my first boyfriend. Like, oh, she's not gonna be gay. I'm like, and what is the problem if I am? Because all my friends were boys and my dad have And he was raising polo horses and cows and things like that. And when I went to the, the, the, the with on the summers with my parents there, I wasn't wearing a t-shirt. I only was in shorts and we got the short hair. Everybody was on impression. Then it was a dude until what summer? I, this GLI is come up. I'm like, oh, you are not a dude. I was really. Horrible as a kid, and I think one of the reasons that I don't have kids is because I was afraid they're gonna come up like me. And I'm like, no, it's not gonna happen. I was a rebel. And I, years later, I understand that I was overcompensating for my dyslexia and my autism because I didn't understand. And I was told too many times I was stupid, I was slow, blah, blah, blah. And it was overcompensated, so it was, I was more aggress. Than more other kids around. And I never felt that I can feed on other people's expectations. My dad and artist, my mama, former Steward dress, that's how my parents met. Teacher for the special kids Cons. My house was full of artists. They were smoking weed. They were the seventies. Hello. You know what it was? Studio 65. At 60, I think 65 New York was nothing compared to my house, right? So nobody, nothing was normal for me. It was normal and I love it. My mom, dad was the second marriage for both. I have brothers and sisters from the oldest, from the first marriage of my dad. Guess what? When they get married, the former mom says they're yours. I don't want these kids. They're terrible. So I grow up with. Brothers and sisters from the first marriage on the seventies. Remember South America the seventies wasn't been with. So when people says, how is your family, my brother and sister, my mom, my mom won my mom too. My grandmother won two, three, and four. And my dad, and they call my parents like, your daughter is Something hit on the head like, no, that's our. We have 4, 4, 4. We have family all around the world, so I never feed on that criteria. And I love the chance that my parents give me. They didn't, they didn't leave me money, but they give me wins. We were an Orthodox. Now you can see families, integrated families. I don't know how they call it. I don't not go with pronouns or names, but I have an integrated family. 51 years ago when didn't. My parents were super open about those things and I love that. I crazy. Love that.

Robin: 14:37

So you said something that was interesting. They said they gave you wings. How'd they do that? What were the wings?

Susan: 14:44

My dad, let me think. We're gonna go with the quality time with my dad. He have a huge studio and one of the things that I love about my books actually, I found out that I can tax, have tax accent for the amount of books that I have. I didn't know that. I'm a public library. If you have more than 2000 books you can apply for Li Public Library, so I remember books and paintings on the roof and spending. You have over 2000 books.

Robin: 15:14

More than that and that and that came from your dad, the passion? No, I bought,

Susan: 15:19

I travel on the wall. So these are new books and actually I have a spreadsheet When I land you a book I write and I send a reminded email says You own to Susan Ivis live public library. Two books do in 10 days. And my friends are like, are you kidding? No, don't mess with my books because I have books. The people that I study, Paul Man, Cini, they're sign, especially for me, those books are do not land them. I have a second pair of books that I can land, but they're my treasure, right? Because for years I didn't read, I didn't enjoy it because of my dyslexia. Now I find out and I can read it and listen the book. So for me or my treasure, there are the things that I never could have conquered. And my dad was an avid. He sometime go to the studio. He's studio on Friday and he doesn't show up until Sunday morning and talking about, and spend all Sunday talking about the book he read. What kind of books did he read? History. He was fascinated. The, I was was a pilot for Hitler, all that part. He loved genetics actually, when in his ranch he allowed the first insemination for genetics done in South America on his, on, on one of the cows, in one of the ships. Genetic history, real history. Because he didn't have the chance to go to college of the Unique, he read about everything, culture of biographies. He love biographies and he love biographies about people. Different perspective. I would put it like the Democrats and Republicans about the same aspect in in, in the world. He loved that. He loved knowledge, but not the traditional knowledge, right? He says everybody do his own path. So growing up with those things, our grandmother who pre escape from Auschwitz, one who was widow at the age of 21 with two kids, traditional Italian family who become an artist just when she turned 40. How are you gonna. All of that. People around the world, all those people, my people, my family did their things in their own way. There's no way I'm gonna be following the path. And my dad never allowed us to work to do any sport professionally until we were 18. Hmm. I was supposed to be on the volleyball team. He says, no, my daughter is not gonna spend five. Five times a week, two hours every day, playing professionally. She need to play. She need to be a kid. My brother, the same. He didn't allow us to do anything until we decide what we are gonna become. Religion, last name, activities, nothing need to be professional when we. Beside what we gonna do. He took me to ballet one day, says Susan. My mom was Susan too. She's not gonna keep doing ballet way. She doesn't like it. Well, what she knows, like she doesn't like it. She's not gonna do it. Move, move on. She gonna choose what she gonna do. And my time was going to the ranch riding. I learned riding horses before I ride. I ride a bike and I spend all day. Between the pigs, riding horses, feeding the couch. I love it. I love that, that the one of the reason I live in the forest now is that connection with my dad. And he always told me, do whatever you want. The only limit is yourself. Nobody can tell you can't do it. And if you wanna do it, just find a way to do it. Don't be so lazy to blaming others who are conditioned. You cannot get. Susan, did

Robin: 18:58

you know your grandmother that was in Auschwitz?

Susan: 19:00

Well, yes. She never told the story. I found out, you know how I found out? Yeah. My, my mom first husband was Jewish. My grandmother buried four husband and they died at the age of hundred and three. That lady had a lot of fun. And my brother, it's true. My brother married a Jewish lady and I ended up marrying a Jewish guy. We agree we're not gonna have kids, but I wanna convert to Judaism. And I went to the painful effort for a year to study. I went to visit my parents in South America. They used to live in a small town in the beach. And my mom says, why you? What are those? All those books like, oh mom, I have the conversion next week. I need to give the test. And she says, if you don't tell anyone, I'm gonna tell you you're Jewish. And like, what the heck? And that's when she told me the story. And like, so you saw me suffering for a year, going through this study knowing how hard, and we are Jewish, is your grandmother wanna say anything? Like why would the crosses and going to a Catholic school, why you did that to me? I never fed. It's because your grandmother's still thinking that she, that she's afraid they're gonna come up and take it. So I tried to talk to my grandmother a couple of times and she says, I don't know what you're talking about. So finally at the age of 33, 34, I went to Austria for a couple of months until finally I could. That's where we're coming from. So I hired a private investigator and through different museums and organization, finally I found my grandmother's sister buried and Barcelona with the name Root. I. That's who I belong to. So I came back to the United States. I went back to South America. This conversation need to happen with my dad. In person says I found who I belong to. I love you today and nobody gonna change. I'm your daughter, so I gonna change my last name. My dad, look at me. with that face. Everybody knows you're my daughter. Do whatever you want. You always hand and he never talk about again. And that's how I wanna become Susan Ivit. I changed my last name to my legal. I'm the last person on the family who keep that Jewish name. Wow. And my gra my grandma die without telling the story. So I have pieces and. Yeah, for the survivors, and it's really common for survivors that they were afraid to tell the story, and she did. And at one point, I stopped fighting and started respecting because I own to be who I am to my two grandmothers widow, a 21 AWI survivor dresses a man on the bottom of a boat. Hello. I own the two ladies not to give up. And every time then I says to my grandparents, I, I fail. They look at me like, really? Okay. And we're not gonna fight just with the really what we went through For you having all this option, you complain about a guy didn't pick up your phone number, you're complaining that you're not doing well in a school. Hello. Grow up. It's not another way. They give you wings, they give you stronger. I always as if I was born and raised in United States, probably sec secret service social service would take, take me and take me away from my parents. I'm so happy. I was born and raised in South America until I was 17.

Robin: 22:23

So what do we wanna do? So we wanted to be an astronaut. That wasn't happening. So what, what did

Susan: 22:27

happen? Hmm. My quality time with my dad was watching Colombo and the reading godfather and the stories about the family in Italy. And my dad was like, who you think is the is is the, is the murder what happened? And reading mystery stories and my dad make me think, okay, this happened and we have what are called wbo now. And we tell stories and like, who do you think or hiding things or made me think all the time. So you

Robin: 22:56

were, so you took these mysteries from Colombo and these other things and put'em on whiteboards with your dad? Yes, I was. I telling you, there's a thread right there. That's

Susan: 23:06

amazing. It's generically crazy. I told my therapist, who, I can blame your parents. Good to go. We can go

Robin: 23:13

and, and, and so I'm curious also, Susan, because you were so visual because of dyslexia. Mm-hmm. Was that, was that natural then to put it on the board? It was easier to do. I mean, tell me about that.

Susan: 23:24

My dad was writing the clues, so it was early signs, but my parents wasn. Educated on the traditional way to understand what happened with their kids, and at least with me. And one of the things is, I remember when I told my mom, I found out that I'm dyslexic when I was 17 and I was autistic when I was 35 studying London. And my mom says, my daughters neither of those things. And it took me a long time to says, mommy, it's not a reflection on you, it's who I am, and I'm so happy. Then I have those things. The only thing I regrets not knowing earlier to have done the path than I want, but every life through your ball, you need to learn to catch it and go for it. So my dad and like, oh, Susan, you're too lazy. They call me Suki. My parent call me Suki and my grandmother call me Bella, the Italian, because my second name is Vahe. Huh. So he called my grand Italian grandmother, called me Bela, the other part of Ham. So, okay. Okay. I'm gonna write it for you. What do you think happened? I think the murderer is the guy on the red shirt. So we did, visually, he helped me to go visual. It wasn't Robert, it was the guy with a red shirt. That's the way I can visualize. Hmm. And we have, and sometime he leave the whiteboard and says, you have until Sunday to discover who killed it or who did it, or who stole it, or who took it. And he would tell me stories. What do you think it happened? So we, we went through that exercise without knowing who I am. Today is that time that I have with my dad. So I grew up thinking what I gonna be or who I gonna be or what I gonna be doing because how a dream can become a career. So when I was seven 15, again, thank God I don't have kids I tell to my parents that college high school was going too slow. So I'm gonna take a year sabbatical and go to the library for eight hours a day to study on my own. The crease is not that I propose. The nuts as they say. Yes. So start going to the library to study and, okay, I'm ready to go back. What did you wanna study? I was reading everything that you can put in frame of me. I was a study law by Lafon. Lafon is Introduction to Civil Rights and Law. And how, and I'm

Robin: 25:49

so sorry, Susan. How were you able to do this with dyslexia? How was that going for.

Susan: 25:54

I didn't know. It's like telling a person that is blind, that not everybody else is blind. You cope, you have coping mechanisms. Okay, so I was hearing so many times that I was lazy. Then I read slower and I have a, the famous tape recorder I remember my mom gave me when I asked when I would turn the suite 16 was a tape recorder, so it was recording my. And at that point you have some tape recordings reading. So I was grabbing everything that it was in tape on the, on the public library. You're doing audible. Right? And what I did is I went to the blind library where they have all this tape recorders from blind people. Oh my gosh. It's brilliant. I was going there and the woman says, why you come? Because it's easy for me to listen and read and says, why don't you go to the blind library? They have a bigger selection of a story and think. What am I? And I remember go to the library, says how much, and I remember collecting my lunch money for like two weeks to pay for my membership on the blind library to be able to listen to those tapes. And I was so happy and I actually, I have a good span. I don't know if you can see it. Yeah, yeah. Because it was like my aha moment, like, oh my God, all this is mine. I can read all these. I got goose moves too. And while you're 15, you're not supposed to be doing that. But was that curiosity? Yeah. Take me to another place. Go to like, what happened. I remember, so Juan Ez La Cruz, she was a nun in Mexico and I found out because they have all these audio tapes, they're coming from Mexico on the nation. And I found out so Juan La Cruz, she dressed as a. To when she was a nun, to be allowed to study history fumy. That's why the first time I hear face reading on the alters fumy, physics, astronomy, and they found out 10 years later, she was a woman and she wrote one of the most amazing poems men, you, your ignorant men who are so blind to understand that you are punishing women. When you become from women, it's way more lovely in Spanish. But it was like, I was reading ELA Cruz, I was reading about Queen, the, the, the golden Age. I was reading about oh my God the one who killed herself. It's a really good, oh my God, I'm really bad with names. Ava Duarte. I was reading about this women figures and like was so empowering and what it mean, and that take me to. Brown, the one who was Jewish and married with Hitler before she died. Right? So all these empowered women. Later I found out about Margaret Tacher in the eighties when England went against Argentina for default Folland. So all these women like, look what they did, look who they become in Maria Korea. Yeah. So it was empowering to listen to that and that's how my brain. To be, to make the impossible possible for only one formula because you want it to happen, right? So when, yeah, it sounds horrible, but when I find out, the blind library was like my aha moment. And I did that for many, many years around the world. Wow. And I still do it sometimes when some languages, now we have Audible, I have more than 223. Today. I check it before this morning because my phone that says you need a memory update. I'm like, why? Oh, I have too many books. You see, the only thing I regret to be born as late is for the understanding with your education limitations, right? And the tools, the technology. I don't have any problem with the technology. Use it in your favor. Everybody love a cell phone, so don't complain about technology. Is that. Technology was, I'm not taking about 30 years ago, 20 years ago. 20. Only 20. Not only five. Audibles is six years. I, Raven, what is five, six years. I

Robin: 29:59

only discovered about two years ago. So I think it's about five years old. Alright, so we're feeling really good. We're empowered, we. Unlocked the secret to our curiosity. Mm-hmm. What was next?

Susan: 30:14

And actually many years later, I don't know if you know Dr. Diane Hamilton. Yes. Oh my

Robin: 30:18

gosh. The Curiosity Code. Cracking The Curiosity Code. I had her on my show. I love her. Yes.

Susan: 30:23

We love Diane. Diane and I, we become really good friends, at least on my side. Let's, let's ask her and I read her book and a first version of the Curiosity Code like many years ago when she wrote it with her. Huh Because of her daughter. The first version, that's how I contact Diane, she had in her show, and one of the, tomorrow I'm gonna do my mental health certification. The next one is Diane, curiosity. So that curiosity, actually, I was looking for a definition. What I, I'm not intelligent. I'm not better than anybody else. I'm a regular chair with a couple certification and a huge, huge amount of curiosity. Mm-hmm. That is when kids are curious and parents says, no, no, no, I don't have time. Please, from all the things you says, no, not be. When the why I never grow when the three years old. Why? Why? Why? I don't wanna grow up if I gonna lose to be curious and I gonna lose to ask why? Okay, so

Robin: 31:25

How come you never lost your curiosity? We're all born with it. Oh

Susan: 31:31

really? I don't know. It spark. I mean, I, I was punched so many times. I always say I always run for the first place and I always come in third. So the only way the, the only fate that I have, then I gonna come from th fir third place to first is to be curious how I can improve. Improvement is a curiosity. Become better in what you do is a curiosity. Losing weight is to be curious. Reading new books is to be. Finding the way to be a better person, leave them better when they met you than before. That is curious, how curious was your dad? I curious. They gave me that. I was telling you I taken the mental health training certification because I'm a horrible empath and I cannot sit in my own life saying, oh, because I'm not an empath and I don't connect emotionally with. Emotional pain. Oh, I am who I am, so I'm not gonna change. No, I need to rationalize. So I use the tools that I have to learn skills that are not natural with me. Ignorance is not to understand. The other people have another needs, then I have, and they need to talk to another way. So I use my left brain. My curiosity to try to rationalize most people is gonna criticize me for that, but at least I make the effort to be rational with those empathy. So when somebody need to be receiving empathy and understanding, whatever use tools are used, at the end, you're gonna have the income that you need me to listen the way you need to be. Why? Because I was curious until I found a way to be better empath and better human being. And I now, the tools that I use are different, but it still is the curiosity to get me to find out that I can do that certification.

Robin: 33:21

All right, so we're curious. We've unlocked our internal power. Keep me going. Where did the human behavior passion come

Susan: 33:29

from? Simple. When I was, when I came back to the, the, the, the high school, I remember Dr. Frisco, my physics teacher, he says, I don't want your, my class anymore. You're a pain in the neck. He was a little more explicit, so, so the other teachers said the same, you are disrupting why I came up with all this knowledge, and when they talk about geography, Because this and this and this. I have a really good memory, this and this and this. Susan, turn it down. Land the plane. It's a simple high school class. No, but you know that black Susan, you don't need to memorize things. Move on. So my mom was called to the school and my parents says, what you have done again, I swear God this time. So the principal, the school says your da your daughter has been expelled from high school with a diploma. Am my no. Teachers want her. They're gonna make a general examination orally, because that's the kind of school I went. And if she pass, she have the paper, she can do whatever want. And my parents are like, she's 16. What the heck is she gonna be doing? Like your problem, she's gonna pass. I took the test a week later. I didn't pass with, I would say, oh, I passed 100. No, I passed with 61. I need to pass with 60. I was good enough. I'm like, now what? So I went to I went to the uni. I was register long philosophy, sociology and psychology, higher achiever. I went first year. I was, why did you wanna do those? Because when I did, oh, I'm sorry. I didn't tell you when I was doing the, the, the orientation. I, the guy says, what you wanna do? And like, we went to a couple of meetings like, I don't know what you wanna do. Anto says, tell me what you wanna do when you was 13 years old. And I found out that everybody ended up being happy when they do what they wanna do between 12 and 15. Maybe not an astronaut, but I was a dreamer. I was trying to conquer for the. And a philosophy where that's what I did. Conquer for the stars. Conquer to be what is untouchable? Being a profiler, being a hostile negotiator, being all the things that I am being a civilian. That was touching the stars with my hands. Huh? So he says, well, you wanna be like, oh, I did. It was my dad, blah, blah. Oh, you wanna be a profiler? You wanna work from the fbi? I. Wait a minute, timeout. I can get paid to do this. Yes, this is what I need to study. So we went through at that point, not phone calls and getting people and talking with people. It says, if by the age of 24 you got your first master in any of these specialties and you study English, you are willing, you are able to apply for the F FBI in a special visa to go and train in Quantico and see what happened. I'm like, we have a plan now I wanna. One of my teachers and psychologists says, Susan, I wanna propose you to be my assistant in introductions to psych psychology and danger, personality and double manipulation, all the things. But your papers are from a five years old, something is going on, disconnected. So he sent me to a career advisor social work worker. And after the test me, I remember, and I'm gonna say literally in part of my French, if you need to put a beep, honey, honey. 17 years old, the bad, the good news is you are hot, so you need to start. You need to look for a husband in PA kids because the bad news, you are highly dyslexic. You're never gonna made it. I'm like, what? What, what you mean? I'm never gonna marry it. Like, no. All your dreams. So get a good husband. So I remember turning around and Liz, can you see my rear end good Because it's the last thing you're gonna see about me and I walk away. I went home and I remember not dating, not about my proud moments, but that's how you deal with and cope with pain. I never, I don't have a recollection. I think it was too painful to remember. It was just two or three weeks. I didn't vape, I didn't eat, I didn't wanna get out of bed that when start smoking, I was a, like a downfall. And my dad says, first take a bath because I'm gonna burn the couch with the, the, the mattress with you on it. I'm gonna be in the studio. And my dad says, how do you think I get here? And I put food in the table and roof in your head. Not because I was tall, it's gonna happen. No, because it was easy. So you have two ways to get to the destination. Somebody fly first class and somebody's gonna be swimming with sharks and look like you're gonna be swimming with sharks all the way to the top. So your mom and I, we decide we are gonna give you the what is the when the emancipation. Mm-hmm. We're gonna give you as much money as we can. have what you have and decide where you're gonna go. So I found that, that it was the first initial. Body language class in Belgium. So this is, I'm gonna go to Belgium. Okay. When you met it there no idea what is gonna happen. And we need to remember 35 years ago, 34 years ago, we didn't have the problem that if you visa, you are legal. Nine 11. Those things that make more difficult to stay there, right? So I went to Belgium, I get my class a year. They was allowed to take it. And I was bartended at night, so one of the people that was studying with me and says, you have this weird brain that allow you to see people, and you get to people's head, you make people laugh, you make people talk and says, I do political consulting. Do well, will you like to be shadowing me? And says, I says, how much you pay, you pay more. The bartender, I. At that point, I wanna do it. I was, I think around 1825, around my first political campaign. I never stopped and I did that for 18 years. What do you think they

Robin: 39:23

saw when they saw you that made them wanna bring you on board?

Susan: 39:27

I think he was in Latin and he was an AM American. Europeans have another shk to see people. I was accepted to do a master in Manchester without having a degree because they saw something on mek and I know, no. And you know what? He died a couple of years ago, and it was one of the biggest laws because without him, I wouldn't be who I am today. He observed me and I remember he says, you're a weirdo. You're a cripple. I need to be taping attention to you. He was observing me and observing me how I interact with others, and he was provoking situations where I need to be an exposed situation, a situations with other, and how I manage those and like why that happened. Tell me more. It was natural because I'm coming from a surviving. Ambience and a surviving life When I was told no parents were different. So I don't know. I wish I can say it was this because I'm sure it's gonna help a lot of other autistic and dyslexic people to find out. And it's not, I wanna make it difficult. I really literally, I don't know, because every time they, I talk to him, you have a gift of what. I can tell you this is a gift you can tangible, but he never give me a tangible what he saw. So

Robin: 40:52

what's likability to you? Hmm? What makes someone likable?

Susan: 40:59

Two things. You and the person around you first, I don't believe the first impression has nothing to do with you. You connect the smell, the voice people is not gonna like me. As soon as they hear, Hey, I'm Susan Ivis. They're not gonna like me. And it's nothing I can do except to find something that we have in common than me too, when we like each other. Likable is the predisposition, the preposition to be open mind, to be seen and seen others to find something in common. They make me. I like to know more about you and that's where I wanna like you. That moment where like we like books, we like audio books, we laugh together. That's what make you lik book. You think making

Robin: 41:50

people feel safe is part of that.

Susan: 41:53

I'm goofy all over the place and where I'm the safest net You're gonna be London. I don't drink the Kool-Aid. I think that can be a possibility because I always start by keynotes of training, says, okay, I've been called Corky, this and this. I'm the autistic. I'm dyslexic. I'm all over the place. I'm gonna have grammatical errors. I don't have all the answers. The only thing I gonna guarantee you if I don't have it, I'm gonna find someone who does it. People lower the barriers and feel like, oh, if she's not perfect doing what she does, it's okay with me to. Gullible and we are, and allow myself to go out there. I think I can provide and maybe I'm should provide or I provide a safe place for people to be who they wanna be because that is the platform that I was growing and giving all my life.

Robin: 42:44

Yeah, I see it too. You're very transparent, which makes people feel safe.

Susan: 42:48

I am you. I am what you see. Yeah.

Robin: 42:51

There's no doubt. That's why it's so much fun to be around. All right, so we go to Austria, we start our, our journey to be the world premier expert in human behavior.

Susan: 43:01

What was next? It was like nonstop. I was working nonstop until I was 30. I never take a break, and that was a huge one because I got burned out. I would say for the only thing I regret, regret in my life is to stop doing political campaign. Mm-hmm. It feels safe. It feels good, and it feels anonymous. What made you, you knew who I

Robin: 43:25

want and I, I apologize for that interruption. No. What made you feel, what made you feel safe? Doing political

Susan: 43:31

campaign stuff, because nobody knew who Susan Ivit was. I was the dark angel. You're not gonna find pick. I don't exist until three years. You look for me, three years before I don't exist because I was working on the dark. I working on the shadows. I was working mouth to mouth. I don't need to do videos. I remember the first webinar that I did four years ago. I throw during before and after. I hate it, and I procrastinate in doing more material in the media because I don't like it. This box where people use their own dictionary to determine who you are without being in my shoes is completely unfair. I don't like it. Right? How people is so mean to others without knowing who they go through, right? So he was safe because nobody need to know who Susan Avit is beside the people who hire. So I was able to says, all the curse are worse than I want. I can be as weird as I am. Nobody criticize you. It wasn't needed to be politically correct. I am not a politically correct person. Mm-hmm. And I'm okay with that because I'm always strategize and thinking outside the box. People hire me From that, I can be all over the place. I miss the adrenaline. I miss to see changes. I mi I, I like to see how I can mold a person and make it. I never work. One of the things that I coach in two political consultants now, the first thing is never ever work with a candidate. You. Hmm. And like why? Because you're starving. A bias. Yeah. If I like you, it's nothing that I can do to modify to be likable because I'm not gonna find those things because I already like you. If I don't like you, no matter what is your flag, I'm a mercenary with that. And still a mercenary. I love it. I can make you likable, so I love you. Your bias, no matter how professional you are, is there. Yeah, so I don't care. I don't need to respect you. I don't need to like you. You can be honest and I gonna make sure that I can find things on you and the people around you to make you likable. If I like you already, we lose. We lose already. Yeah. When people says, I always work with Democrats or Republican, like, I don't care. I always work with cases. I was talking to

Robin: 45:50

you just work with people you don't like. I

Susan: 45:52

like, let me put it another way. I love it. I was talking with a trial and a white, white, white crime lawyer. So white crime is one of the big three letters. Call you for something that you did wrong, Uhhuh, and says, I never work with somebody who's innocent. What about you? Like, are you crazy? No way is too much pressure to working with somebody's innocent because they think because they're innocent are gonna be not liable. The cemetery, the books and the jail is full of people who is who I, who are innocent or they were perceived because they're innocent, they're gonna win. There's no way. So working with somebody's innocent under the perception, just because of that, they not gonna be filed liable, is not true, is too much pressure. They think they have their own bias and the perception that is gonna happen. So the same way I work with politics. So I work with a, with a, with a client on and, and, and law. So, and law is like, says, I don't care if you did it, don't tell me, I don't care if you did it, who you did it, what, who you did it with, why you did it, how you did it. I just gonna make sure you do what you pay me to do. And most people think I'm a bitch and probably you're 100%.

Robin: 47:07

So we have this vast experience. I love the insight of taking on clients that you don't like because only you could then make'em likable. Mm-hmm. So how do we become the human polygraph?

Susan: 47:20

That was an article and it was a lot of controversy and I love it. I went to study in, I can't imagine

Robin: 47:27

that you like controversy. Sorry, go ahead.

Susan: 47:31

I didn't write, actually, I found out that it's already set it up so I'm allowed to say it. I, I, and you see my pass four is going up. Yeah. I've. Somebody approached me two months ago and says, I've been reading about you and following on the media. I'm, I'm right from Psychology. Today I'm gonna make an article how somebody with all the odds against her become she, she become, I'm like, You want to write about me using my name? So the article is approved, it is coming on March and I'm so nervous and I usually don't say anything until coming. But what says from all the conquerors that I did in my life being write about me and how I conquer all the things and I con all the odds against me. They put me in Ex Ice Stand and Spielberg, I wanna see the final article and how no matter how people tell, no it's gonna happen. So I went to Europe to study polygraph and that that's how you and I met because we did a special out the concept of the polygraphs. So I wanna study another thing that I wanna study. So I study polygraph, and I remember I fail horrible. Again, failing is the best tool and that's how I learned how polygraph work. So two or three years ago, Most of the journalists who look for me and they're gonna interview me, they don't tell me who is gonna be how we gonna met or who I gonna be met in, because they're gonna tease you like, okay, tell me something about me, nobody else know so I can read your face and things. So first of all, this journalist happened the same when I did the two front page of Trio Tribune. I didn't know who are gonna be interviewed. So this guy come to me, I read his. And says, okay, I'm gonna start lying to you and you need to tell me how and when. So I let her go. Go tell me more. Hmm. Interesting. What else? And I was betting him and we're talking about journalist who's been in this field for 60 years and I was taking notes and like, okay, tell me, okay, you like here and here and here. Why? I can see your charact tie that happened, blah, blah, blah, blah. And you was cringing and doing this. And like he was like, holy cow, you're the human polygraph. Whatever make you happy. And when the article came up, I'm like You, Susan Ivit says, the equivalent of the human polygraph. And I do not believe when people says, I'm a human polygraph while human lie detector, or you're never gonna lie to me, or it's impossible lie to me, that is the first lie. There are three ways you can be good in this job. Who you. are How you feeling and how predisposed you are not to drink your own Kool-Aid and walk in a room thinking everybody have a reason. Everybody's telling you the truth. I just wanna know if you're lying and go with the flaw. I'm sure it happened to you, Robin. You have a pedigree that we can work and you can write on a cyclopedia if you go into a room with a bias that the person is lying and not an open mind and being curious, doing questions. Like you said, some more of the interviews. I didn't use force. I didn't coerce people to be sp for us, I use kindness. I use questions, I use curiosity. I make them feel. We have something called the CSI's effect when sometimes you lost cases because the juries are, the jurors are expecting like the CSI things, flight in the dna n a and like. It's not true. It's connecting with that person. Let them talk. When you let them talk, they're hanging themself, right? But not people want to be cock and not. So that's how I ended up the human polygraph. Again, I love the title. I think it's fun. They put it on my website. Do I think it's the Human Polygraph? No, you got me on a Sunday. After I went with with my friends, I hung over. I need bacon and a Bloody Mary not talk Me. I'm hope exception detection of the worst.

Robin: 51:26

So Susan, we could talk for hours and days and weeks and months as we will continue our relationship and friendship together. But let's go back to the polygraph a second and leave people with maybe two or three things, not to how to be a human polygraph. Cause I think you just hit upon something that is the most important that I think resonates with everyone. And that is, in order to do those things, you have to be really present. Mm-hmm. What recommendations you have for people to start being a little more present so they can be a better observer. The things around them so they can start on that journey to being able to detect what someone's doing around them a little more accurately so they can forge better relat.

Susan: 52:05

Don't over research. When you over research about something, you are already going. You're looking for the fulfilled prophecy. You're just looking for whatever the person is gonna tell you to feed an apostle that you already have. That is danger. If I think dating, oh, that guy is perfect. I'm so deceive. The guy is not perfect. He never was. Deception coming for your expectation not to be fulfilled for the reality of the person who they are.

Robin: 52:31

Deception coming through your expectation. What a great statement. Keep going. Sorry. That

Susan: 52:35

was fantastic. No, no, it's simple. I'm not more intelligent. I'm a simplify things because my brain need to simplify. So that's what I do with things. So if I dece you, you get feel this deception through. It's because your expectations never gonna f I'm never gonna feel your expectation. I'm human and imperfect like every other human being. Don't try to make me perfect. Don't put me in a pedestal. Don't do that. I'm not, I'm not a, a, a, a poster boy for anything. No hero, hero story. I'm failed the same way that anybody else. Give yourself the chance. Don't fulfill the prophecy. Not be allowed to people to deceive you in any way because it's your own. People don't do the right questions. People don't like to you, you don't do it. Second of all, being able to listen to the cues, do not be expecting to look for the next question. Sometime pauses are the best way you can take talk to people is the most uncomfortable thing for you to make and for the other person to. But if he says, like you, I was going like, ba, ba, ba, because I'm nervous. I was before the interview, like doing this like, Robin, I don't like this. And just stop and like, wait, wait a minute, wait, wait. What about Auschwitz? And like, okay, I'm gonna need to calm down because I cannot go get away with this guy. He gonna caught me. So go there. And I'm saying like, tell your help. Tell me more and how that make you feel and how you that happened and why it happened. Be with your body, the tone of your voice and your hands open. If I says, tell me more, like, tell me more. I want to hear more. Be present in your boy, in your tone of voice and your words don't be critical, and why that happened. Wait, wait a minute. That is not right. No, don't tell people what is right because what is right for me is not right for. So be open about the other person. It's not about you and how you wanna be talked. It's how the other person need to receive the information, ask question, be curious. And the third one, do not read. And I know it's gonna be controversial. Do not buy the book for the cover. Wait until re you read the first chapter. Everybody has a story and everybody's gone or went through things that you don't know to, don't be so easy to criticize and put a finger in another person. Never, never. I love books and I love the analogy. Wait until the first chapter. Because then you can understand why the title is what it is. Until then, you ju you fail, know the book in your hands. You fail to be curious enough to understand what is the first chapter, and everybody have one first chapter that can allow you to understand what it coming from. And then you're gonna be present all the time.

Robin: 55:27

Oh my gosh, I love that analogy. Don't, don't judge it till you read the first chapter. Oh, I love it. It's beautiful. Susan, out of all these great things you've done recently in your life, Or maybe even before then, what's brought you the greatest joy?

Susan: 55:43

Moving to the forest and doing my 40% of my job pro bono. And you're never gonna see it in any, I'm on the war of so many associations, so many things. And taking so much of my time has given me so much joy. And I'm not gonna say what it the way they are. You're not gonna see it on the media and. Give me joy, and I'm so proud of myself to get out of my comfort zone and my lazy backhoe To go and do it for the first time and feeling it is narcissistic. It's altruistic. I don't care. I have so much joy. I'm so proud of myself to get outta my comfort zone and do it

Robin: 56:20

joy through service and getting outta your comfort zone. Yep. Perfect. So Susan, what's something I should have asked you but I didn't ask you and you wanted to make sure you.

Susan: 56:31

Nothing. You, you are, and you were a really good interrogator. No

Robin: 56:37

interrogation.

Susan: 56:38

I hate this. I hate it. People thinking, oh, but you're not. Well, no, I hate it. I've been preparing myself all day and keeping bbc, so I don't know. But you make it look so natural and you make it look so easy, and it's not. I've been interrogated and interviewed with people like, what the heck? I was thinking when I say yes, and I love your show and your podcast because everybody. It's been interviewed in a different way because you use your way to make that person shine. It's not about you. You get the the guest to be there. So it's nothing. I would say, shut up Susan. We can make this shorter. That's the only thing you should have done.

Robin: 57:19

Oh, you're beautiful. Susan, thank you so much for coming on and sharing everything. Last thing, where can people go to add a little bit more, Susan to their.

Susan: 57:28

You can go to human behavioral lab.com. I google my name, I hate it, but I'm a branch. So go your notes. Yeah. Human behavioral lab.com and you can find, we have videos, dailies, we have articles, we have newsletter, and we have new classes coming. We have web words, emotions, and behavior. It's a new class because I don't think one thing can go together and we are doing crazy things all the time. So take.

Robin: 57:53

Awesome. Susan, thank you so much for sharing your amazing and compelling backstory and insights for everyday life. No doubt. Thank you so much, Susan. Thank you for tuning into another episode of Forged By Trust. Remember, if you want to forge trust, it's not how you make people feel about you that matters. It's how you make them feel about themselves. If you're interested in more information about how I can help you forge your own trust, building communication, interpersonal strategies For yourself or your organizations, please reach out and contact me@www.peopleformula.com. I'm looking forward to sharing my next Forge by Trust episode with you next week when we do a deep dive into discipline listening with Michael Reddington.